[gmx-users] viscosity calculation using g_energy (3.3.3)

JMandumpal jesbman at rediffmail.com
Wed Mar 25 03:12:15 CET 2009


 Dear Berk,

                                 Thanks for the reply. I have read through your paper. I have still some doubts.

When used tcafś  I got files called

tcaf_all.xvg  tcaf_fit.xvg  tcaf.xvg  visc_k.xvg ( all default names).

I think, the file which I should use for fitting, using the formula eta(k) = eta (0) (1-ak²) + O(k^4)  the viscoty ( viscosity - k vector plot) is visc_k.xvg. Am I right? 

IF yes, what all other files ( tcf_all.xvg, tcaf_fit.xvg and tcaf.xvg) do?

expecting your reply,
Jestin

On Fri, 13 Mar 2009 Berk Hess wrote :
>
>Hi,
>
>I don't understand what you are actually doing now.
>You seem to be mixing multiple methods.
>
>First off all, I would use NPT for all methods, except the one that uses the pressure fluctuation.
>The pressure will have a large effect on the viscosity and if you run NVT you need to have
>exactly the right volume.
>
>If you use the cosine acceleration method, the 1/viscosity is printed in the energy file,
>g_energy will plot it for you.
>
>g_tcaf is only for use with an equilibrium simulation.
>If you read the paper, you will have seen an expression to extrapolate the k=0.
>
>Berk
>
>Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 07:33:30 +0000
> From: jesbman at rediffmail.com
>To: gmx-users at gromacs.org
>Subject: Re: Re: [gmx-users] viscosity calculation using g_energy (3.3.3)
>CC:
>
>
>  Dear Berk and David,
>
>
>
>                                           Thank you very much for your appropriate and informative replies.  I tried another method (traverse current method) to calculate the shear viscosity ( a non equilibrium method, which has been described in Berkś paper : Journal of Chemical Physics, 116, page 209 ( Determining the shear viscosity of model liquids from molecular dynamics simulations)),
>
>
>
>                            I used the g_tcaf utility (ie g_tcaf -f traj1.trr -s binary.tpr -oc test.xvg) . As suggested by David, I increased the system size ( from 500 to 2048 TIP4P molecules). I ran in NVT ensemble which allows the pressure to fluctuate.
>
>Apart from that I added following options to my mdp file, where accelaration of 1A/ps² was given to the system.
>
>
>
>;NON EQUILIBRIUM STUFF
>
>acc_grps                  = system
>
>accelerate                = 0.1 0.0 0.0
>
>cos_acceleration          = 0.1
>
>
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>Moreover, I saved the trajectory in every 1ps ( so total 500 frames for a 500ps simulation)
>
>
>
>then,
>
>
>
>I got the following output:
>
>k  1.593  tau  1.000  eta  0.09835 10^-3 kg/(m s)
>
>k  1.593  tau  1.000  eta  0.09835 10^-3 kg/(m s)
>
>k  1.593  tau  1.000  eta  0.09835 10^-3 kg/(m s)
>
>k  2.252  tau  1.000  eta  0.04917 10^-3 kg/(m s)
>
>k  2.252  tau  1.000  eta  0.04917 10^-3 kg/(m s)
>
>k  2.252  tau  1.000  eta  0.04917 10^-3 kg/(m s)
>
>k  2.252  tau  1.000  eta  0.04917 10^-3 kg/(m s)
>
>k  2.252  tau  1.000  eta  0.04917 10^-3 kg/(m s)
>
>k  2.252  tau  1.000  eta  0.04917 10^-3 kg/(m s)
>
>k  2.759  tau  1.000  eta  0.03278 10^-3 kg/(m s)
>
>k  2.759  tau  1.000  eta  0.03278 10^-3 kg/(m s)
>
>k  2.759  tau  1.000  eta  0.03278 10^-3 kg/(m s)
>
>k  2.759  tau  1.000  eta  0.03278 10^-3 kg/(m s)
>
>k  3.185  tau  1.000  eta  0.02459 10^-3 kg/(m s)
>
>k  3.185  tau  1.000  eta  0.02459 10^-3 kg/(m s)
>
>k  3.185  tau  1.000  eta  0.02459 10^-3 kg/(m s)
>
>
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>Which shows a strong k dependence over the property: shorter k, better the viscosity, as pointed out in the paper. However, the value obtained is around 0.01 times less than the experimental value (1pa-second). Adding to that, the results obtained by this method seems to be very convincing unlike the g_energy that shows a great divergence!!
>
>
>
>So the situation is getting better now. Now, I would like to know whether this can be improved if I save the trajectories more frequently ( 500 fs) and run for longer, say 2ns or change value of accelaration .
>
>
>
>Any thoughts ?
>
>
>
>
>
>regards,
>
>Jes.
>
>
>
>
>
>On Thu, 12 Mar 2009 Berk Hess wrote :
>
> >
>
> >Hi,
>
> >
>
> >This is a very inefficient method for determining the viscosity.
>
> >Also you need really perfect pressure fluctuations: NVT, shifted potentials,
>
> >probably even double precision.
>
> >There was a mail about this recently.
>
> >There are better methods, have a look at:
>
> >http://dx.doi.org/10.1063/1.1421362
>
> >
>
> >Berk
>
> >
>
> >Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 07:39:52 +0000
>
> > From: jesbman at rediffmail.com
>
> >To: gmx-users at gromacs.org
>
> >Subject: Re: Re: [gmx-users] viscosity calculation using g_energy (3.3.3)
>
> >CC:
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >David,
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >Thanks for the quick reply.
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >Indeed I did  as what you suggested- g_energy -f water.edr -vis test.xvg
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >The output file created includes three columns.
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >1. time ( ps) 2. shear viscosity (3) I assume it is bulk viscosity.
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >It seems, the unit given is cp. ( 1cp= 1* 10¯3 Pascal Second).
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >The bulk viscosity of water at 300 K is approximately 0.7 cp. But the value ( Bulk viscosity) I got from the program gives me 100 pa-s, an increase of two order of magnitude. I wonder whether I have done anything wrong while specifying the frequency of saving energy file.
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >I have saved the energy file in every 2ps. Isn´t that enough for a simple system like water? OR should I have to save trajectories in every 5fs as suggested by one in a previous post.
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >I post the first 20 lines of the output file.
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >-------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> ># This file was created Thu Mar 12 16:20:09 2009
>
> >
>
> ># by the following command:
>
> >
>
> ># g_energy -f water.edr -vis test.xvg
>
> >
>
> >#
>
> >
>
> ># g_energy is part of G R O M A C S:
>
> >
>
> >#
>
> >
>
> ># GROup of MAchos and Cynical Suckers
>
> >
>
> >#
>
> >
>
> >@    title "Bulk Viscosity"
>
> >
>
> >@    xaxis  label "Time (ps)"
>
> >
>
> >@    yaxis  label "\8h\4 (cp)"
>
> >
>
> >@TYPE xy
>
> >
>
> >@ view 0.15, 0.15, 0.75, 0.85
>
> >
>
> >@ legend on
>
> >
>
> >@ legend box on
>
> >
>
> >@ legend loctype view
>
> >
>
> >@ legend 0.78, 0.8
>
> >
>
> >@ legend length 2
>
> >
>
> >@ s0 legend "Shear"
>
> >
>
> >@ s1 legend "Bulk"
>
> >
>
> >    1.99203      9.6633     96.3893
>
> >
>
> >    3.98406     11.1625     98.1365
>
> >
>
> >     5.9761     12.6631      99.838
>
> >
>
> >    7.96813     13.4652     101.366
>
> >
>
> >    9.96016     13.7012     100.249
>
> >
>
> >-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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